Saturday 25 August 2012

New ideas from the conference on South Asian Archaeology and Art in Paris

 
 


In July there has been in Paris a great conference of the European Association for South Asian Archaeology and Art with the presence of many important archaeologists and scholars from Europe, Asia and America (you can see here the abstracts), like Kenoyer, Osada, Vidale, Skilling, Karttunen, and Sanjeev Gupta, an Indian geologist based in the Imperial College of London. He has spoken of some discoveries already discussed the last year (see here and this article), which concern the 'Ghaggar', ugly modern name of (a part of) the Sarasvatī. Recent studies on the deposits of Kalibangan have shown that there is not sand of a Himalayan river during the Mature Harappan Period, but only before 15 kya. That means that after that age the river was only seasonal, based on the monsoons, who were stronger in the 3rd millennium BC. The sites on the old river bed could also exploit the fertility of the depression were the rain waters accumulated. As Osada of the 'Indus project' (based in Kyoto) insisted, the 'Ghaggar' was not a mighty river in the Harappan period, and this datum has been used for denying that the Vedic Sarasvatī is real or identifiable with the Ghaggar. But all this harmonizes with the name itself 'Sarasvatī', meaning 'rich in pools or lakes', which can be said of a rain-fed river. Moreover, it is true that the gveda speaks of a river flowing from the mountains to the sea, but the same is said in the Mahabharata, where it is clearly described the disappearance of the river at Vināśana in the desert, from where, it is said, it re-emerges at Camasodbheda (MBh IX.34.78; III.80.118). Moreover, in RV III.33 the Sutlej (Śutudrī) joins the Beas (Vipāś), and the fact that there is no allusion to a change of course gives no more chronological problems. In the Mahābhārata (XII.139.13-24), the catastrophe between the Tretā and Dvāpara Yuga, which can be seen as a description of the crisis at the end of the Mature Harappan period, is caused by a lack of rain, and not by the change of a river course. So, the data given by Sengupta and Osada are consistent with the tradition.



Another interesting paper was that of R.S. Bisht, read by Kenoyer, because unfortunately the Indian archaeologist was absent. It was about some particular hemispherical tumuli in the cemetery of Dholavira, which resemble some structures found in Bahrain (2200-2000 BC, or more precisely 2050-2000 BC) and also the historical Buddhist Stūpas! Particularly, Tumulus 1 (see above) has ten radial walls forming a kind of wheel-structure, which are found also in Bahrain, and in Stūpas (see below the Sanghol Stūpa). So, it seems that Bisht is going to assert that also the Stūpas have their roots in the Harappan civilization. About Bahrain, we can suppose that these tumuli are  connected there with the merchants from Gujarat: 2200-2000 BC is the same period of the seals found in Bahrain of clear 'Indus' character. But for which kind of people where these tumuli used? Maybe for religious men, like the Buddhist Stūpas? And are there other traces of Stūpas in India before the Buddhist period? According to Buddhist tradition, they were normally used before Buddha Gautama for the Pratyekabuddhas, who were wandering ascetics, and also Jains used to erect Stūpas.




What is also interesting is that apparently the symbol of the spoked wheel was present not only in the script, but also in funerary architecture: another possible sign of the importance of the spoked wheel in the Indian ideology. And the presence of this structure also in Bahrain could show the diffusion from India to the Middle East of (at least the idea of) the spoked wheel already at the end of the 2nd millennium BC.

    

21 comments:

  1. Thanks Man its just wonderful, clearly G-H is a perfect fit for Sarasvati if we don't have any kind of agenda to prove of course:-). But please tell to the interested people why the name Haraxvaity appears for Helmand as to the Avesta then?.
    Yes the stupas In Bahrain can indicate a link between India! And we probably don't have to think of Scythian origins Of Gautama and Buddhism like Witzel puts:-D.
    Surely the mention of Ships having 100 oars in Rigved was probably not a joke which is quite consistent with the fact also that Harappans sailed for trade.
    Spoked wheel: This wasn't expected thanks to the site and again like Mitanni and the Peacock motif this again proves ancient relations of Middle East with India BTW what is your Suggestion on The origins of Scythed Chariot? Is it Indian with trdaition speaking of Ajatashatru using it? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ajatashatru#The_Buddhist_tradition_2
    Or Its like the wiki?:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scythed_Chariot
    Have a good time.

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  2. i have the similar questions with an extra one for the author; what made him walk the different path compared to most other academics?.

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  3. About the last question, I had a sort of conversion at the beginning of 2004, when I found in the libraries of Pisa books by K. Elst, Rajaram, Sethna and B.B.Lal. I found some arguments very strong, and so I changed my mind about the Aryan invasion, which previously I accepted without having deepened the subject.
    About Harahvaiti, it is not to be identified with the Helmand, which was called Haetumant in Avesta, but with the Arghandab river, where was the ancient Persian province known in Greek as Arachosia, corresponding to the region of Kandahar. According to Boyce and Grenet (http://books.google.it/books?id=MWiMV6llZesC&pg=PA125&lpg=PA125&dq=Harahvaiti+river&source=bl&ots=2aQJxzhf2T&sig=B_Cyx_hVEaILdHcXckL6Q9OAhdA&hl=it&sa=X&ei=98VNUKP6Ho7Vsgbwh4GYBg&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Harahvaiti%20river&f=false) the name of Harahvaiti was given to the Arghandab by the first Iranian settlers "after the chief river of their mythology, believed to pour down from the great world-mountain and to be the source of all other earthly waters." But this identification of the cosmic, heavenly river with Harahvaiti seems an idea of Lommel (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aredvi_Sura_Anahita), not confirmed by the Avesta itself. It is probable that the Arghandab was called Harahvaiti, Iranian equivalent of Sarasvati because it was also rich in lakes, and we can see today that its course is very complex, and near Kandahar with some ponds. It is interesting that near the Arghandab there is the ancient site of Mundigak, which had close relationship with the Indus civilization (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mundigak).

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    Replies
    1. The clear and frequent impression in rikved confirms that the arya culture flourished with ample existence of urban culture where the philosophic rishis were prone to a more village like lifestyle, with simple logic it can be said also that the numerous kings whom are mentioned in over a 1000+ suktas were prone to the opposite.
      The arya heartland was between the saptasindh to the north west in bactria so mundigak was most likely arya, though i think the region of bactria was occupied by pre-zoroastrian aryas after the prominent part of rikved was well composed around the time of Brahmanas composition which i date 1600+ bc. and of course sindhu and other close urban cultures were fading at that time due to as we now know drift in the climate.
      The aDNA of mundigak,BMAC has the key to reveal the truth in a direct way though we still don't have a sniff of farmana do we?.

      Delete
  4. About the scythed chariot, here you can find the quotations of Xenophon speaking about Cyrus as inventor: http://penelope.uchicago.edu/~grout/encyclopaedia_romana/miscellanea/chariots/scythedchariots.html
    Morevoer, it was a typical Persian war chariot, so it seems that the invention is Persian, and maybe it arrived in India already at the time of Cyrus, or of Darius. It is possible that Ajatashatru in Magadha has adopted it from the Persian-dominated area in northwestern India, anyway if I were an Indian I would not be proud of such an invention!

    ReplyDelete
  5. Thanks, you are an oasis of truth in the desert of mythyas.

    ReplyDelete
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  10. Mr. Benedetti, Hi i'm Alan O'Brien Just amazed by your blog,but why are you taking the side of the degenerated Indians? as we fairly know anything which is valuable there is a gift of the white race!

    ReplyDelete
  11. Hi, I am quite surprised that you seem to appreciate my blog while stating such a thing. I don't know what do you mean as white race, which is not a scientific concept. Anyway, using some conventional classifications, I deny that India was invaded by 'Nordic' people from the Pontic region, the origin of the Indo-Aryans was probably in Iran and Central Asia, and they were constituted by 'Mediterranean' populations like modern Indians.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The presence of Swastika in Neolithic cultures worldwide is undeniable but the oldest is in Eastern Europe, the swastika is a symbol of sun worshipping farmer Aryans, since farming is not of Indian origin the Aryans are also not...

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    2. As I said above, presently I don't think Aryans are of Indian origin, but from Iran or Central Asia, as farmers of the Middle Eastern tradition. The Swastika (which is a Sanskrit word) is found not only among Aryans, but also among Native Americans! So, it must be pre-Neolithic... however, it was particularly used by Indians since the Bronze age.

      Delete
  12. My view
    1. Aryans Spread farming worldwide creating archaic impact which is now forgotten/lost.
    2.They were west asians and present in India for 6000+years.
    3.The term means "soil tillers" like in Arable.

    ReplyDelete
  13. It is almost dawn here and before i sleep by term white i meant loss of pigmentation due to farming, the lifestyle which had less vitamin-D but obviously superior to Dark skinned Hunter-gathering lifestyle...
    Alan.

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  14. @Alan
    Tell us Truly First, Are you a neo-NAZI Or a teenager?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

      Delete
    2. Well, we have learned that you indeed are a neo-Nazi, although original. According to the recent studies, the mutation of white skin has occured much before agriculture: http://www.plosgenetics.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pgen.1003912
      According to your theory, Northern European hunter-gatherers were dark skinned?
      On your site, I have seen an article about Ahimsa: as a Sanskritist, I would say that this word litterally means absence of violence, not harming living beings. It does not allow retaliatory violence. Your concept cannot be identified with ahimsa.

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    3. I have removed the comment with the link because I do not want to support Nazi propaganda on my blog.

      Delete
  15. Northern Europeans are Gentiles.
    You must understand our aim is beyond race! see the article 'Unity Through Nobility'...
    Alan.

    ReplyDelete